S1: Hey there , San Diego , it's time for KPBS roundtable. I'm Andrew Bracken. Thousands of San Diego homeowners may have been overcharged for their trash pickup. We hear more about what went wrong and how homeowners and city leaders are responding.

S2: There need to be change at the city of San Diego. That change needs to start at the top.

S1: Then fryer fans can rejoice. The Padres are back in the playoffs. We take a look at how they made it and their road ahead. And we take a look inside. KPBS popular surf reports and the voice behind them. It's coming up on KPBS roundtable. For over a century , San Diego provided free trash pickup for single family homes , unlike apartment buildings and businesses. That changed in June of 2025 , when the city approved new trash fees that would show up on homeowner's property tax bills. This week , we learned that tens of thousands of people may have been overcharged for trash pickup , some by more than $1,000. The city blames a technical glitch. Joining me to talk all about what's happening is David Garrick. He covers City Hall for the San Diego Union-Tribune , and he broke the story this week. David , always good to have you here.

S3: Thanks for having me.

S1: So help , you know , help us understand the story. And I think to start , you know , we do have to go back when the city established these trash fees , how do the fees work?

S3: The fees work that it's roughly 40 something dollars a month. It depends a little bit on the size of your can , but instead of being billed monthly , you're going to get billed on your property tax bill. That was a way to keep the bills a little lower , because instead of creating a billing department that might have cost like $10 million to create. The city said it would be cheaper to do it through property tax bills. But this week we realized that maybe that was a big mistake. Yeah.

S1: Yeah. So. And then , you know , voters approved this. It was like a measure be back in 2022 to kind of get this ball rolling on these trash fees. But there were objections to the new fees , particularly around the pricing , because it ended up being higher than originally projected. Take us through. That.

S3: That. Yeah. So leading up to the 2022 election , it was in November of 2022. The city's finance people , it's called the independent budget analyst did a guess at how much the fee would be. The reason that matters is because that's what goes in the voter guide. So all the voters , when they saw this thing , this ballot measure , they were told it would be between 23 and $29 a month. And I think a lot of folks say that was one of the reasons they supported it. And of course , then when it got approved , the city did a thorough study for about a year and a half , two years and determined it should be quite a bit higher. And a lot of people call that a bait and switch , and it created all kinds of turbulence and frustration. Um , and if you want to take it further , there was a lawsuit filed over that , and then a ballot measure was threatened. And now the city has agreed to lower the fee to roughly that that old number adjusted upward for inflation in fiscal year 28 and fiscal year 29. Right.

S1: Right. So a lot of pieces here. And yes , they settled that lawsuit. Um , but now it takes us to this week. And you you know , you're reporting here that the city may be overcharging tens of thousands of residents. How did you discover what was happening here?

S3: Uh , some residents saw their trash bills , and they thought they looked too high. Actually , they got their property tax bills , which were issued last week. They were posted online. They haven't been mailed out in most cases , but they were posted online last week and some very ardent people checked their property tax bill the moment it's posted on the county website. And they looked at it and it seemed too high to them , and they went to the city's trash portal and they compared. And a lot of these people noticed that the numbers were different and they were curious why would the numbers be different? This seems confusing. And and so they got together quite organized and did an analysis of like a hundred different addresses. And they found out about one third of them had an error where the numbers didn't match up , and in almost all cases they were higher than they should be. The county was higher than what the city said it was. It was charging. So they figured this must be an error. We don't know what to do. And they emailed me and maybe some other media outlets. I'm not sure , but they emailed me. I was very interested , but I figured they were probably wrong. I have to admit , I just figured , you know , maybe they're confused. Maybe they have done the math wrong. Turns out they were 100% right. And what apparently happened was the city , when they sent the figures to the county tax collector to put on the tax bills , there's some sort of glitch in the way they sent it. It appears that maybe there's a line item on your property taxes for the trash. It appears that maybe it clicked 2 or 3 times. So typically you're going to get charged either double or triple of what you're supposed to be charged. But there are other instances where it's not double or triple. So I don't really totally understand it , but it appears it's multiple charges for the same thing in some instances , and others I they can't figure out what the cause is , and neither can I.

S1: And some may be under charged.

S3: The city has said that , but they haven't given that number. They said they believe 87,000 people have been overcharged and there's 220,000 customers. So that's more than one third. Um , but they've said there are some other charges , but I've asked for a number and I haven't gotten one , so I'm not sure on that.

S1: I mean , how is the city explained why this happened? You mentioned this , you know , technical glitch or whatever , but have you got any more information on.

S3: Other than other than the words technical glitch? I have not gotten anything as question is , is it a mistake by someone in the information technology department? Is it an algorithm they ran that they poorly created? You know , I don't really know , but Kent Leaks Councilman member Kent Lee made a point. He said when the mayor does this probe to figure it out , he doesn't want him to pin it on one employee. He feels like this is a systemic failure and it should be treated as such.

S1: When talking about the city council. You know this. This is not only kind of gotten the attention of homeowners , but obviously city council members to have responded. City leaders. At a committee meeting earlier this week , City Council member Henry Foster , the third , had quite a lot to say about the way the mayor's been handling this.

S2: There needs to be change at the city of San Diego. That changes to start at the top. The mayor needs to look himself in the in the mirror. And if it's time for him to step down , then he needs to step down.

S1: So obviously some some tough words there. He also kind of went on to say , you know , he pointed to the mayor's decision to eliminate the chief operating officer position for the city. How does that fit into this? What we're seeing with , you know , this issue with the trash bins.

S3: I think the city council could argue they've been vindicated because since the city eliminated that position in early 2025 , they have repeatedly called for the mayor to restore that position. That's someone to oversee the day to day operations of the city , sort of like a city manager in one of our smaller cities. That's the person where the buck stops there. That's the person. When they walk into a department , everyone is scared because the boss is in in the room. Right. And the city doesn't have that. Now the mayor is doing two jobs. He's doing mayor as a political job , and he is acting as COO. And the council has expressed concerns about that. And they didn't specifically say we might have a technical glitch that overcharges people for trash , but they hinted that they were worried that the management wouldn't be as sound as it should be. And this certainly appears to be an example of possibly if we had a coup , this wouldn't happen. Hard to. Say.

S1: Say. Yeah. Um , you know , also earlier this week , KPBS asked the mayor about this , you know , the fallout from the trash fee. Here's what he had to say there.

S4: Absolutely unacceptable. And we're working swiftly to correct it. You know , this is a highly complex endeavor. And it's been made complicated by , you know , external pressures around referendum and whatnot. But no one needs to hear anything about excuses. What they need to hear is that we're going to take immediate corrective action. I want to thank our county tax collector , Larry Cohen , who has picked up the phone and is moving heaven and earth to make sure that we can correct this as quickly as possible. Um , you know , it's it's a regrettable error. Folks will be held accountable and we will get this fixed.

S1: So , yeah. Can you tell us more about this moving heaven and earth here? What exactly is the city doing to fix these issues.

S3: As fast as possible? They're trying to get the county numbers corrected again. The city the numbers on the city website are accurate as far as they've said , it's the county numbers that don't match up that need to be corrected. And they're trying to do it before the bills get mailed out. But that's a process that was already sort of underway. I don't think they'd been mailed , but they were in the process of being mailed. So I'm not totally sure.

S1: Because property taxes are due November 1st.

S3: They are coming up. One thing to point out , those are not delinquent until December 10th , and I would never want to encourage anyone to pay their taxes late. But I'm saying the timeline might be a little bit more generous than people. But it's still November 1st. December 10th. Both are are close soon. Uh , anyway. But the city wants to to. The hope was that there would be nothing mailed out. That would be incorrect. But if some have already been mailed out , then you'd have to mail out a second one. If incorrect bills had been mailed out , you'd have to mail out a second one , and then people might be confused. The second one might have to tell them the first one wasn't true. So I don't know if the city is going to meet that that goal of getting this corrected before they go out. They had vowed to have all of the county numbers correct by the end of the day. Today. I haven't checked in the last few hours if they've gotten there , but I believe that that's probably doable. The question is if they'll be the mailing.

S1: So , David , this , you know , latest saga here that you've been reporting on with trash pickup. You know , it does remind me of some of the past conversations we've had over the past year or so. Um , paid parking at Balboa Park. They'll kind of roll out there. We've had you on. It was a little bumpy , and then they ended up kind of backtracking from there. Mission Bay bathroom. Similarly , all these kind of play into the city budget , and we know the finances with the city are a big concern. You know , what do you take from from this story this week and what it says about the city's financial picture? And you know , how it's going about trying to increase revenue that it needs.

S3: Yeah , I think this makes it even more bleak because I think , you know , they've done polls. Certain labor unions have done polls to see if a sales tax measure , which is sort of the only way to save the day , is to get a sales tax measure approved in 2024 , the city put one on the ballot and it narrowly was defeated by voters. But the thought is that at some point voters might approve a sales tax increase. Sandy , who has the lowest rate of any city in the county. But when you continue to make these blundering , incompetent errors , I think it makes it much harder for voters to trust you , to give you another $400 million a year to spend when you haven't spent the money that you've been given wisely. And I think this is just compounds that. I think the Balboa Park parking and the mission Bay bathrooms. But to see this error , it's just I think if I'm a voter , it doesn't make me confident that I want to give the city government another $400 million to spend every year.

S1: David , what can residents do now? You've talked a little bit about this , about just the property tax bills come and do , but what can they do if they're worried that , you know , they're affected by this? How can they check.

S3: Well , and that's a key thing to point out. I mean , I doubt anyone will probably end up paying in the long term , the higher rate. But there are folks who are suffering a lot of anxiety because they've gotten this bill that's higher than they're supposed to pay. And if there's someone who barely makes their mortgage every month , this could mean the difference between making it and not making it. And if you have an impound account , if people know what that is , where your property taxes are built into your monthly mortgage payment , you know , it's a very complicated way to for the city to fix this in the county. So it's going to be a complicated process. And so people may have to pay more upfront and then get a refund later , which some people's budget doesn't allow you to pay more upfront and get a refund later. But what the city is telling people to do is just sit tight. There's nothing you can do. Don't file a protest. They don't want 87,000 protest letters. They're going to sort it out. They're aware of the problem. They will give refunds. They say they're on top of it. And you just sit tight. You should maybe check your your trash portal at the city site , and your county wants to make sure to see if you're if they're off. So you're aware there's a problem. But other than that , you don't need to file anything or do anything , or get on the phone or run to City Hall with a picket sign. Great.

S1: Great. Yeah , thanks for sharing all that with us and for breaking down the reporting. Um , I appreciate you sharing that with us today. I've been speaking with David Garrick from the San Diego Union-Tribune. You can read his reporting on the trash pickup fees at San Diego. Um , the San Diego Union Tribune. Com. We'll have links to that on our website as well. David , thanks so much for being here.

S3: Thanks for having me.

S1: Padres fans can rejoice after a season of some ups and downs. the friars have made it to the playoffs once again. Talk more after the break. You're listening to KPBS roundtable. Welcome back to KPBS roundtable. I'm your host , Andrew Bracken. Well , Padre fans have a reason to celebrate today. The Padres clinched a spot in the playoffs last night after beating the Los Angeles Dodgers , 4 to 2. It'll make their third straight trip to the postseason a franchise record. This 2026 Padres regular season has come with a lot of ups and downs , but is ending on an upswing. Here to talk more , I'm joined by Eduardo Ortega. He's the Spanish language voice for the Padres , and he's also celebrating 40 years in that role. Eduardo welcome back. Great to talk to you.

S5: Hola , Andrew. Thank you very much. And thanks for your audience. I'm very happy to be here , especially with all this celebration. The last few hours for the Padres fans and of course , part of my 40 anniversary broadcasting Padres baseball in Spanish.

S1: Not a bad 40th anniversary present for you last night. I know you probably had a pretty late night , but , you know , take us through it. You've covered your fair share of locker room celebrations , you know , over the years. How did last Nights compare?

S5: Well , last night was I would consider that like the new generations and way to celebrate for the players. It never gets old and always is special because you see the faces and of the players excitement , especially those who are going for the first time in their careers in the postseason , the longtime minor league veterans who get a chance to be in the majors , and of course , the all the downs we have in the players injured. But , uh , the what I'm really more excited is one of the best bullpens ever that we have seen in the past. And that's where part of the key part. To bring us all the way here. Yeah.

S1: Yeah. And I want to talk more about those , those keys. But , um , just real quick. First , last night's game seemed , I don't know , in a way to me to mirror the Padres season. In a way , it took it , you know , a few innings to get going. They didn't score their first run until the sixth , the sixth inning , but they found a way and pulled away at the end is that , you know , kind of a fair way to characterize the season at large? Yeah.

S5: Yeah. You know what? It's one of the most electric games for my experience , especially the importance of the game , because all Septembers were a play of games for the Padres. They were facing really the tough times. And when they call up , of course , the big stories , Ethan Salas cashing in those big key games back to back with a veteran pitchers like Robby Ray , Nick Pivetta , they trust him , they like him and he showed his maturity , maturity and be and those key games and only 20 years old. And also I would say , uh , the first 5 or 6 innings before they scored the first run with the sacrifice fly. That is something that tells you what the character of the team in the matchup between Pivetta and , uh , or the Tyler Glasnow did. We saw something you don't see very often in the regular season. We got like a 17 strikeouts in less than six innings combined. So that's a great dominant pitching and a quality starter for for Glasnow. But uh , he loves the game because the Padres they did the little things. They keep plays. And that's where at the end what they got him there to make the postseason.

S1: You know you touched on this just this how how great the team has been this September. Earlier this year things did not look you know nearly as optimistic. But the second half of the season , they really kind of took hold. They had an eight game win streak going earlier in September. Do you remember , as you know , watching all the games , covering all the games here? Do you remember when things , you know started to turn around for this team? What changed?

S5: Uh , well definitely it will be the second half after the All-Star break. Especially starting with Fernando Fernando Tatis when he had his first home run by the end of May. It took him almost 60 games. That tells you it was going to be a very tough season because one of the leaders is not hitting the power and also the production that everybody expect from him. It's a big start. And Manny Machado , we know the team will go as far as many goes because he's a great leader in the offensive lineup and they start hitting , they start producing. And with the adding of the great first baseman of the Gold Glove from last year , the San Diego State product and Thai friends he he's having. He's having his best year career in that way. They bring also they brought up a players from the utility role when they have the original plan. The had veterans including Nick Castellanos , Ty France. They have Miguel Andujar on the bench and then the that project didn't work at all for the baseball operation with A.J. Preller in his 11th season as a general manager. But , uh , and then they start adding those experienced guys and recently , of course , Austin Hays , uh , Dustin Harris. And then lately we saw when they went down for injuries , Rengifo also with broken leg and Andujar with the wrist surgery. So they have Ethan Salas and those late additions. So it makes a big combination in the manager in his rookie year he had. He got a gale. A great help from Robert Niebla. They call him the associate manager as well. Still the pitching coach and a great responsibility. And Ruben is one of the best pitching coach definitely in his generation. And he well respected and he managed. He handled the pitching staff as we saw very consistency. And we call him I call him the Spanish broadcast Doctor Niebla , the doctor in Niebla , because when the team is on , the team is in trouble. He goes to the mound and he brings the remedy right there.

S1: And you earlier you mentioned at the top like relief pitching and just the power of the relievers , you know , of the Padres. Talk more about that. Obviously the Padres are familiar with just having , I don't know , legendary really strong all star closing pitchers. But talk about the relief pitching and the role that's playing in this team right now here.

S5: Um , in my 40 seasons calling Padres baseball , there's always excitement. That's the part I really enjoy when the team is leading in the late innings , and since I can remember , I was much younger. Of course , I was a little kid when I the parties had Rollie Fingers , the Hall of Famer , when he came for a couple of years with the Padres. His best years , of course , were with the Athletics. But , uh , after that we have in the last , I would say 25 , 30 years , we have the Mark Davis , the Cy Young , and for 46 saves in 1989. And then we have another ups and downs , different closers. They try different methods. And lately he built you remember that he built the tackle. And then we had Trevor come on forever. He was a Hall of Famer of course. Yeah forever. Hoffman. And we really had those top of the lines on this specialty in the closer roles. And when they got last year Mason Miller , that was so special. Not only because he's the the powerful guy in the bullpen with the highest rate of speed. And every time he comes to 104 102mph. But this is the personality in that control of the situation. And he has the level to be a really the key part for to lead the bullpen. And and that is probably , in my opinion , the Padres really , really season behind the starting rotation with a lot of problems. We only have like two starters. They went you remember a lot of times with the openers and bullpen day , and they call up in ups and downs and also take him bullpen with a couple of guys. Matsui started very late. J.P. Morgan didn't start the way he's closing. So we saw really in the veteran Juan de Peralta. He helps a lot because he's a lefty , and that's part of the composition of what the bullpen was through all the year. But now , are they ready to go? They said they all set.

S1: So they're ready to go as you say. And they're you know in this wild card round. So we know you know they'll start playing baseball on Tuesday. Playoff baseball. The wild card rounds best of you know , three game series with one interesting caveat. The higher seed gets to play all the home games. What can you tell us about who the the Padres may be facing next week in the playoffs , but also the possibility of some home games? Correct.

S5: Correct. Right now , the Padres going to do the best , probably in the next three games is not easy. Diamondbacks? They still alive. Remember the the shaky team really in high risk to be eliminated in the next couple of days. Is Philadelphia because Arizona winning when they swept the Rockies this week. Now they in San Diego. They're going to try to take the third wild card spot. The Padres right now can go to Chicago. If they don't take a two game , a one game lead or stay one game lead to the end through Sunday. That's the the key situation based on the system. The Cavs are one game behind the parties. If the the cops are going to have um the four game series starting with doubleheader today in Boston with those weathers , which could be risky for them. They have back uh , Alex Bregman who has the the broken , uh , the face a lot of fractures with an accident. He was on deck when he got a foul ball from his teammate Michael Bush in a in the game last Sunday. So they they back in with a big star on the third base. So right now the power is for me is they are waiting that series in Boston. And the Padres can host in Petco Tuesday. As today I would say the cops are going to Wrigley Field. The other scenario is the Diamondbacks beating the Padres and Phillies will be eliminated because they are only two games behind and there's three games to go. So in the next few hours we will know more about those.

S1: Yes , there's still a lot of things happening and the Padres have some meaningful games left. It's their final homestand this weekend. They have three games against the Diamondbacks. Um , and also in addition to the games , it's also the Padres are celebrating Hispanic Heritage Month. And I'm wondering , you know , for yourself , you've been broadcasting games in Spanish for the Padres for 40 years for the majority of the franchise's history. Can you talk about you know , why that's , you know , celebrations meaningful and also how you're feeling going into this weekend?

S5: Well , very special because my anniversary. Exactly. I started my full time broadcasting Major League Baseball in 1987. I was a call up. And the previous season in September 86th , I started it when I was 22 years old. So I seen a lot being working for the parties through five different ownership groups , and I'm very proud of all of them because they , you know , they really take care of our community , the Hispanic community in San Diego , and of course , south of the border. I'm originally from Tijuana , and I know all those great , great efforts. And we have this section tonight in the pre-game ceremony they call Comunidad Awards. The Community Awards is presenting for the people , the leaders in sports , in medicine and all the , you know , leadership , but also the social service. And that's important. That's the spirit behind baseball to the community. And the Padres are doing very great job on those areas on both sides of the borders. And today will be special and tomorrow as well. And Sunday we have the cancer we lost to the Tijuana five consecutive years sell out so everybody can , you know , enjoy themselves and be part of the last home series of the parties. I'm going to do the Spanish lineups on the field , introducing the players. So that's special because they are not you know , the baseball in general is an international sports culture. They're going to honor the flags from all the countries represented by this talent , the players , the coaching staffs and , uh , they want to be , um , again , you know , recognized and honor for their lives and their families. That's important because baseball is a family sport.

S1: Well , and on that kind of , you know , international peace you mentioned also shout out to , uh , the Toros de Tijuana. And then they win the Mexican League championship earlier this month. Right. Correct.

S5: Correct. Last last week they beat , uh , Tabasco in six games and Tijuana clinched their the third championship. They started in zero four. Carlos Hernandez , my partner , the former Padre catcher. He's the color commentator with us in Spanish Padres baseball. He's a special consultant for the ownership group of the Toros. And Roberto Kelly , a big leaguer , former big league. He was the manager. Tijuana won in 2007 and 21 and 26. Is that the third championship in Tabasco? They only have one. And they lost. After 33 years , their first championship series , so it's exciting. The baseball in this region is really high. Well , these. Days.

S6: Days.

S1: Wouldn't it be great to have San Diego follow suit on Tijuana's coattails there? That would be pretty cool. Um , you know , just in the we have about , like , 30s left. And I'm just wondering , you mentioned this 40th anniversary kind of reflecting on all these years. Any particular moment stand out to you?

S5: Well , Andrew , always my first game , of course , in Candlestick Park , San Francisco , in the first rotary of the Padres. And that always stayed with me because that was my official debut. But I felt like a dream coming , becoming true. And , uh , Tony wins life in baseball. Tony wins , you know , was so special a privilege for myself to call almost his 20 year career. He started in 82. I started in 86. So that is very special in this the last three times the clinch is that in the history of the franchise , postseason clinching in Dodger Stadium is so special , the fans really embrace that. In 1996 , I remember , as always , when the Padres got to LA in second place , they took over the first place to win the division at Dodger Stadium with Tony Gwynn , Chris Wynn , his brother. And then when two years ago in 2020 for the Potters with a triple play ending the game. Remember that. Too.

S6: Too. Yeah.

S5: Now , last.

S6: Night we'll have to leave it there. We'll have to.

S1: Have you on. Hopefully more to talk , more memories. I've been speaking with Eduardo Ortega. He's the Spanish language voice for the San Diego Padres. Eduardo. Gracias.

S5: Gracias of Myanmar. Thank you guys.

S1: Welcome back to KPBS roundtable. I'm Andrew Bracken. Here in roundtable , we like to talk to journalists and storytellers who cover all kinds of aspects of our region and local culture. And that includes the world of surfing. If you spend much time at all listening to KPBS , chances are you've heard Scott Bass and his surf report.

S7: Grays bring southerly peelers as smallish south energy meanders into the county. Low tide and indefatigable barrage of weak five second wind swell. Piddly waves toppling over , lackadaisical as if they're tired. I just want to take a nap. We have some west northwest winds ten miles per hour. That's putting some texture on the surface. A little lumpy like the icing on a German chocolate cake.

S1: It's just a taste there. But whether the waves are bumpy , crumbly or glassy. Scott Bass has long been here on KPBS , giving us his signature ocean updates each and every weekday. And through those surf reports , he's helped San Diegans , maybe to connect to our ocean and the culture around it just a bit more. Whether we surf or not , and we wanted to chat more with him about that. Scott Bass , welcome to roundtable. Yeah.

S7: Yeah. Thank you Andrew , it's good to be here. Yeah.

S1: Yeah. Great to have you here in person. I mean , I got to start with just , you know , I think I have a vision in my head of how you make the surf report , and it's very , you know , melodramatic has you , like overlooking the ocean. But how do you come up with your surf reports each and every morning? Yeah.

S7: Yeah. So there's a variety of different ways that I eventually boil it down to what you hear on the radio. And it starts with just pure data points. So I will scour the internet. There's buoys that I look at. There's a forecasting websites , there's windswept websites. Sometimes I have to go to the National Hurricane Center website , so I'll grab various data points. But sort of overlaying that is the fact that I've been in the ocean here for over 40 years , and I'm in the water every single day , more or less , you know. And so I have sort of just a real sense of what's happening in the ocean because like I said , it's it's around me each and every day. I live on the coast , and it's just a part of my DNA. Okay.

S1: Okay. So you're not looking out your window , right in these. Out.

S6: Out.

S7: I do look out the window. You know , when I'm stuck on some sort of horrible metaphor or simile or something , I look out the window for guidance.

S1: Well , I mean , you know , you kind of. We heard a little bit of this earlier. The way you describe the look in the feel and the waves. You , you know , you take all this data as you're just describing , but you really , you know , give it to us in a very unique style. Your own style. How do you think about the language around surfing and things like the ocean , the waves?

S7: Well , I mean , it's it's not super complicated , really. What I do is I just I will I will look at the ocean for a while and go , well , what does it look? I know it's gray and I know it's glassy , but how can I convey that? You know , for over and over and over again , because I've been doing the report for a long time , and you can only say it's grey and glassy so many ways , you know. And so , you know , sometimes it looks soft. And I'll think about something that's soft , like this morning there. I used the word cashmere. I said the clouds are like coastal cashmere. Or it might be , um , that the sand or the ocean surface is textured. And I'll ask myself , how what does it look like besides just saying , you know , it's textured sometimes it could be , um , you know , dollops of a meringue pie if it's extremely windy , there's , you know , so I basically kind of just sit there and think about it for a while , and , and of course I will , you know , go through a thesaurus or I'll talk to my wife and , and I do have a dear friend who's a creative writing professor at UCSD and over the years he's given me that sort of like that word of the day calendar where you can peel off a word of the day. And sometimes , as I mentioned earlier , I'll try to crowbar a word in that that I've never even said before. In fact , funny story , if I can , I'll tell you a funny story. This dear friend of mine and his wife had a young kid who was in the San Diego County spelling bee , and she won the spelling bee for all of San Diego County. It's a big deal. I think it's televised even maybe even on KPBS. And and she won using the word fuliginosus. And I went out to dinner with them that night , and they were like , yeah , our daughter won. She used the word fuliginosus , and I go , oh my gosh , what does it mean? You know , fuliginosus basically means sooty or a charcoal in nature or like a gray , if you will , sort of foreboding and , um , and I'm like , you know what? Tomorrow morning I'm going to crowbar that word into my surf report. And I did the surf report , and I mispronounce the word. I think I said fugal or something. I just didn't say it right , you know. And I told my wife , of course , my wife was just upset. And , uh , but that's sort of an example of sometimes grabbing words that I'm still trying to figure out and trying to crowbar them in and also make it sound like I use those words every day , which of course I don't.

S1: Yeah , but I mean , it kind of fits into this , you know , voice we hear describing our sea in our waves. And I think , you know , for me , like , I may not even understand all the terms. I mean , is there just a basic vocabulary breakdown on how we can better understand the waves , like what concepts are most important for someone to understand it?

S7: Yeah , that's a great question. I think one of the big ones is the interval , the period that the swell energy comes in. Sometimes I'll say , you know , southwest swell at 18 seconds. Well , 18 seconds swell energy is much more powerful than , say , an eight second or a ten second period , which is basically a wind swell. So there's just not as much energy behind the wave. So an eight a three foot swell at 18 seconds could be a 6 to 8 foot wave when it reaches the shore , when it interacts with the bathymetry of the local coastline , whereas a wind swell is just not going to have that much power. A three foot wind swell is going to be a three foot wave. A three foot long period groundswell could be a 6 or 8 foot wave. Well.

S6: Well.

S1: I want to kind of go back a little bit. You mentioned , you know , you've been here in our oceans for a long time. I think you said 40 plus years. You spent a lot of your youth here in San Diego. I think you grew up in North County. Can you talk about what San Diego was like at that time , and how surfing started playing a role in your in your youth? Yeah.

S7: Yeah. Well , so we moved here in 77. I was 12 years old and we moved to Del Mar , California. And Del Mar specifically was much different because there wasn't any development east of the I-5. Carmel Valley had yet to be developed. So out there where Torrey Pines High School was , the the high school was the only thing out there. I went to a friend's house next door neighbor , and he had a pile of surfing magazines , and I was already , of course , on a skateboard , riding a skateboard around. And skateboarding is basically sidewalk surfing. You're sort of simulating. You are , in fact , simulating surfing. And then when I got to the surf magazine Surfer Magazine , you know , I was just engrossed in the adventure and the hope and the promise and the excitement that that the subculture of surfing presented to me. And so I just completely was absorbed by it. Hmm.

S6: Hmm.

S1: You know , I think , I don't know , in conversations I've had with surfers , sometimes I've found it hard for folks to put into words what is so magical about surfing? I think , you know , it means so much to a lot of people , especially here in San Diego. Um , but , you know , sometimes it can be hard kind of communicating to maybe someone that doesn't serve. What's so special about it? You know , why do you think that is kind of hard to encapsulate?

S7: Yeah , it's a great question. And it's one that , you know , people ask us all the time , right? Like , people will get out of the water and I can tell that they're they just feel really good about themselves or about their they're they're just they're being there's a sense of of happiness. And I in fact , I mentioned um , one time I asked my daughter. She goes , gosh , I feel so great. You know , after surfing , I was like , why do you think that is? And we couldn't really come to terms with what it is. But my sense is that there's quite a bit at play that we don't think about. Of course , the top layer is , look , we're exercising , you know , our heart rate is going up , we're getting brain chemistry is firing. Um , and that's the case no matter what exercise you do. So there's that. Then on top of that , um , you know , we're in nature. We've entered , um , this beautiful thing , the Pacific Ocean. And , um , and just being in nature and exercising those two things are just , you know , just positive things , right? And then on top of that , a lot of times we don't realize , but subconsciously when we go in the ocean , we are entering the food chain. And so I think when people get out of the water , they're like , oh yeah , I feel great. I don't think they acknowledge that you just survived. Maybe that's part of the reason you feel so good. I mean , there's rip currents , there's big fish , there's stingrays , there's stuff that can , you know , do you harm. And so , um , there's that part of it. And then I guess sort of the last part is that , and as cliche as it is , I do believe that that surfing has a spiritual nature to it. And and I'm not sure what it is. I don't think it's hunting down waves and riding the waves. My sense is , Andrew , is that when I'm sitting quietly in the evening , there's no one around me. I'm looking at the horizon line. It's just , um , there's a there's a stillness that is really powerful. And the horizon line provides so much hope , and you're staring at hope for hours. And then that stillness that I mentioned , I think all of that sort of evokes , um , sort of , uh , you know , like a universal spirit , if you will , for , you know , for I don't want to get too in the weeds with , um , spiritual dogma , but there's something there. So there's those things , there's the exercise , there's the spirituality of it. There's the surviving of your surf session. All of that stuff adds up to a phrase that has been used in advertising in the surf industry , which is only a surfer knows the feeling. And it's really that kind of sums it up. It really is hard to express what it is that we feel. And it's really only a surfer knows the feeling.

S1: And so much to it , like you mentioned. I mean , one thing that that comes to me , I'm not , you know , much of a surfer , but you talked about that kind of dangerous aspect. It's like , I feel like I kind of have to accept that I'm not in control when I'm in the water. There is that you mentioned like , rip rip currents , things like that. I mean , it's just it's such a powerful force and yet such a source of beauty and all this other stuff. So , um , surfing can also feel , I don't know , a world that can be kind of , like , hard to enter. I felt , you know what I mean? Just the culture can be hard to to , like , get in with. It can be hard to get started , you know? What do you say to someone that may be interested in getting into surfing , but , you know , maybe intimidated or may feel a little. Yeah , not know where to start? Yeah.

S7: Yeah. There is a sense of , you know , like we're dealing with a limited resource , right? There's only so many waves that are coming in. You've got your hour and a half in the water. you do want to get that exercise that I mentioned , you know , you are kind of hunting down your way of , so to speak. So there's a selfish nature to it , which probably pervades that sense that , hey , these people aren't really welcoming me. It's not like , for instance , like if I go skiing , I go up to mammoth or something , and I'm in a in the line. Everybody's genuinely nice and talking and talking about their last ride and where they're going to go next. And there can be sort of more of a , um , like , you know , um , blinkers on , blinders on in the water , you know , not necessarily talking to each other maybe. Um , and I think that speaks to sort of that selfish nature that we're dealing with a limited resource which , you know , conveys what you're speaking about , this , this , this subculture that's a little bit intimidating , perhaps , and not as welcoming , perhaps , as I would have hoped. But that's really genuine. It's gone. It's gotten way better , you know , especially post-Covid. There are so many new surfers to the to the sport and to the culture , which is great. You know , my feeling is more surfers , the better. That just means we've got more happy people , you know? And um. But yeah , so it's gotten better. But yeah , I understand that there is a bit of an intimidation factor.

S1: So , I mean , I think people really respond to your surf reports and frankly , whether they're surfers or not , you know , I've had conversations with folks that just how much they enjoy it. And we've talked a little bit about some of the reasons why and the language you use. But I'm just curious , have you , you know , had any memorable interactions with fans or feedback from folks? Because I do get a sense that people really connect with those surf reports. Yeah.

S7: Yeah. No , I've just , um , I'm always excited. I'll get emails from people , um , saying , hey , love what you do , you should put out a book , you know , keep doing what you're doing , that kind of thing. And , um , and it's wonderful. And I always respond and say , hey , thanks so much for listening to KPBS. We appreciate your support. And , um , and I've gotten I've gotten emails from people in Iowa that listen to KPBS streaming and they're like , hey , I love your surfboard. I'm here in Iowa. I used to live in San Diego. I had a girl in Washington , D.C. who has a Substack as a writer , and her mother said , hey , you should interview Scott Bass. I listened to a surf reporter every morning. I don't surf or anything , but it's wonderful. And so she did , you know , an interview in Washington , DC on basically , I don't know if it was a political Substack , but it was something in DC and we just talked about how neat it is. Um , you know , the connection , I guess because of the internet that people can have all over the world with , with KPBS.

S1: You also , you know , do quite a bit of work within San Diego's surfing community and the culture around it. I'm just wondering if you can leave us with some final words here. Like how would you encapsulate what surfing means to San Diego?

S7: Well , it means a lot. Surfing in San Diego are tied at the hip. They're one and the same. Um , you know , the surfboard building industry started right here in San Diego in the early 50s with Gordon and Smith and some others. Um , it continues to thrive. The surfboard manufacturing industry. There's quite a few surfboard builders in San Diego and up in Oceanside and , um , and yeah , I mean , look , you see surfboards in centerfield at the at Petco Park at the Padres games. Um , we've got luminaries , just legendary characters like Skip Frye and Donald Takayama and Gary Linden and the list goes on and on. Here in San Diego.

S1: The legendary. Surf.

S6: Surf.

S1: Board makers surf. You know , just surf figures in the region , right?

S7: Yeah , yeah. And so , um , and of course the Wind and Sea Surf Club , which is like an it has an international , you know , sort of carries the flag for San Diego around the world in some regard. And , um. Yeah. So surfing in San Diego. I mean , it's one and the same , right? You've got blacks. You see the golf tournament on TV. They're looking down at the surfers down at Blacks Beach. Um , you know , the La Jolla , the Scripps Institute of Oceanography. Everything's just tied into the ocean here. So it's just a natural.

S1: I've been speaking with Scott Bass. You can hear his surf reports right here on KPBS each weekday mornings around 7 a.m. , eight , and again in the noon hour. Scott , it's really great to hear you know more about how you approach the surf reports. And just thanks for. Yeah , letting us in to to your process. Yeah.

S7: Yeah. Thank you Andrew. It's a pleasure to be here.

S1: And that'll do it for this week's roundtable. Thanks so much for listening. Roundtables technical producer is Brandon Truffaut. The show is produced by Ashley Rush. Kayla Park Minho is newsroom production assistant , Brooke Ruth is roundtable senior producer. And I'm your host , Andrew Bracken. Thanks again for listening. Have a great weekend.